The JO Situation: Finally, closure!

[aunt_zelda]

http://tgwtgrumours.tumblr.com/post/17808829670/jesuotaku-and-the-rumours#notes

FINALLY! Someone confirming that yes, JO said that awful stuff. It's great that she's changed, but it was bothering me after the whole TGWTG Secrets debacle that she was denying she ever said that stuff and making things horrible for Rants and the confused fans and those of us who actually read the formspring post that has since been deleted. 

And now we can put this whole business to rest. Now that it's all out in the open ... I think I can watch JO's reviews again. *smiles*

Just got back from my first college party. Yaaaaaay! Pretty small, lots of fun dancing, lots of sexy dancing, lots of me watching people do sexy dancing and wanting to join in and not knowing the protocal for that, and me headbanging to Katy Perry and stuff. I'm sore and sweaty and I had fun. I'm glad I went out with my friends. 

Comments

So sorry

[rumour elf (from livejournal.com)]

Oh my god, I am so, so, so, sorry that I didn't contact you ahead of time. I completely dropped the ball on that one. I cannot apologise enough. I blame an over-fried brain because I've been putting this post together for hours and hours and it's now 6am in the UK, but I really don't have an excuse because it didn't even occur to me to contact you.

I'm normally good at contacting people ahead of time, so I'm really, really sorry that I didn't notify you ahead of time.

Re: So sorry

[aunt-zelda.livejournal.com]

Dude, it's ok! Don't worry about it. A little head's up would have been nice, but whatever, just something to keep in mind for the future. I'm really glad that you made that epic post about the whole situation and put it all to rest.

I've spent most of my time in this fandom with a little nagging worry in the back of my head about the trolls, from the minute I posted my first TGWTG fic to when we got the Secret Treehouse up and going to when I heard Bennett was going to read one of my fics on MFT to when TGWTG people started tweeting about fics ... yeah. I worry too much about that.

Again, thank you so much for all your hard work. You are making a difference. I haven't watched any of JO's vids in a year because of ... that stuff, but now that it's all in the open I feel like I can start watching her stuff again. Thank you.

[gethenian.livejournal.com]

I could have told you, and will tell you, and will continue to tell anyone who keeps bringing this ancient shit up over and over and over -- JO is not a homophobe. It's ridiculous and unfair that people keep bringing this up.

[aunt-zelda.livejournal.com]

It's over now. What was bothering me was that the formspring post was deleted and people were acting like it was a wild accusation that she called being gay a "lifestyle choice" ages ago when it was actually true.

But it's done now, her opinions have changed, and I feel like I can watch her videos again. So that's good. That's actually really, really good.

[awesome-emmy.livejournal.com]

Glad to know this is finally settled. Honestly, I wouldn't have even paid any attention to people bringing it up again if she and the other reviewers hadn't flat out said people were lying about it.

[aunt-zelda.livejournal.com]

Glad to know this is finally settled.
Oh god, me too!

Honestly, I wouldn't have even paid any attention to people bringing it up again if she and the other reviewers hadn't flat out said people were lying about it.
Yeah, that ... that really bothered me. It seemed to make the whole situation worse, like not only did she say that stuff, she then denied it and got her friends and coworkers to lie for her to make it seem legit and condemn people for talking about it. Thankfully it's all out in the open now, so they can't deny it anymore.

[freya-sacksen.livejournal.com]

Tbh, what bothered me more was JO's flat out refusal to acknowledge it had happened. I believed everybody saying that she had changed and was no longer a homophobe. I was willing to buy into it - if she had said 'Okay, yeah, I had said some really problematic stuff, but that's in the past, and I apologize for it.'

Knowing that she did, in at least some corners, acknowledge and apologize, softens me somewhat towards her.

Edited to change to slightly more appropriate icon. :-D

[aunt-zelda.livejournal.com]

Tbh, what bothered me more was JO's flat out refusal to acknowledge it had happened. I believed everybody saying that she had changed and was no longer a homophobe. I was willing to buy into it - if she had said 'Okay, yeah, I had said some really problematic stuff, but that's in the past, and I apologize for it.'
Yeah, me too. I can accept that people can be raised in a certain way that they have these unfortunate beliefs, and when they get online and/or grow up they find out that those beliefs can hurt people's feelings at best or be considered grossly offensive at worst, and then they learn and grow and get friends and change for the better ... but you have to be willing to admit that you said that stuff, and certainly don't deny it to people's faces.

Knowing that she did, in at least some corners, acknowledge and apologize, softens me somewhat towards her.
Me too. It's why I feel like I can watch her videos again. That and the fact that the information is all out now.

Edited to change to slightly more appropriate icon. :-D
I love that icon.

[freya-sacksen.livejournal.com]

Yeah, me too. I can accept that people can be raised in a certain way that they have these unfortunate beliefs, and when they get online and/or grow up they find out that those beliefs can hurt people's feelings at best or be considered grossly offensive at worst, and then they learn and grow and get friends and change for the better ... but you have to be willing to admit that you said that stuff, and certainly don't deny it to people's faces.
I just consider it part of being an adult. This whole thing would have been over a lot quicker if JO had said 'Yeah, I said some really homophobic things a while back; however, I have reassessed my beliefs and come to the conclusion that they were incorrect'. Boom. All of this would have blown over SO MUCH QUICKER, there wouldn't be all this hubbub about it and people wouldn't still be calling her homophobic. The worst she might get is people asking what caused her to reassess it or asking her what caused her to have those beliefs in the first place, in which case she can just say 'I don't feel comfortable answering those questions'. Leaving those questions unanswered leaves a lot less hubbub than denying something which people can confirm for themselves.

I love that icon.
It was an awesome conversation that led to it. :-D

[aunt-zelda.livejournal.com]

Mostly, I felt bad for Rants. Poor guy was trying to keep a lid on a crazy mess and thought that people were telling lies when they were actually telling the truth.

This whole thing would have been over a lot quicker if JO had said 'Yeah, I said some really homophobic things a while back; however, I have reassessed my beliefs and come to the conclusion that they were incorrect'. Boom. All of this would have blown over SO MUCH QUICKER, there wouldn't be all this hubbub about it and people wouldn't still be calling her homophobic.
Exactly. That's all that was needed. *sighs*

It was an awesome conversation that led to it. :-D
I'll bet!

[freya-sacksen.livejournal.com]

Mostly, I felt bad for Rants. Poor guy was trying to keep a lid on a crazy mess and thought that people were telling lies when they were actually telling the truth.
*snarl*
Don't talk to me about Rants. I fucking hate Rants. After his victim-blaming white-knighting douche-baggery regarding the whole 'one of the contributors is a stalker' and ARGH FUCK I HATE HIM HATE HATE HATE.
...yeah, don't get me started on Rants.

I'll bet!
Over in fanficrants, somebody midway through a rant about how authors kept dividing people up into 'straight' and 'gay' said 'bisexuals are not unicorns! They exist!' and someone decided to make 'Bisexuals/Pansexuals Are Not Unicorns' icons. I snatched up one while I could. :-D

[achika-chan.livejournal.com]

Butting in to say I kind of agree about Rants. It was good of him to let that secret through, because obviously that's something that needed to be addressed if it was true, but then he went and kind of ruined it. And I really don't get why everyone is all over him saying how he's such an amazing person and SO NICE and stuff. Like, he doesn't seem like a dick, but...that's just basic human decency and nothing to need special attention. I really have to conclude that it's because he's a GUY that he gets most of the fawning he does.

[freya-sacksen.livejournal.com]

And that last comment to her, oh god, the one where he said that without evidence he couldn't trust her, and how he was all 'oh nobody came forward' because with all your white-knighting, yeah, you made it so easy and such a welcoming atmosphere for somebody to come forward you attention-seeking asshole!

ARGH.

[achika-chan.livejournal.com]

Typical male privilege douchebaggery, sadly.

[freya-sacksen.livejournal.com]

It's because of assholes like that that I almost threw myself off a bridge last year. It wasn't cool then, it's not cool now.

Also, the fact that Ven kept giving Rants Holly's contact details, and he didn't post them until Holly herself gave them...oo, that makes my blood fucking boil.

And then, when I tried to call him on it, he just went 'oh, but no one came forward, this is just a secrets blog what do you want meeeeeee to do about it?'

[achika-chan.livejournal.com]

People were under no obligation to come forward to fucking Rants of all people, it's not his business if someone was stalked/molested/taken advantage of/whatever actually happened since I don't know specifics. Maybe they came forward to HOLLY and not some fan on Tumblr. Especially a guy fan.

[freya-sacksen.livejournal.com]

Like I said though - the fact that he put off posting her details until she gave the details was just icky. Especially when Ven had been asked by Holly herself to give the details.

Beyond that, Rants could have easily given the details at the start, it's not like any of that is private information.

[achika-chan.livejournal.com]

Yeah, you're totally right. I have no idea if it was true or not (no one's ever confided anything like that to me) but I error on the side of, you know, actually believing victims. The first thing he should have done was post Holly's contact info.

[emeriin.livejournal.com]

Hey now, don't insult the gender by lumping assholes like him with everyone else.

[achika-chan.livejournal.com]

Ah, sorry. I didn't mean that all guys were assholes. I meant that he was coming from a place of 'male privilege' where sexual assault and things like that are a much more distant threat than to someone of the female persuasion. But you're right, I could have worded that better and I apologize.

[emeriin.livejournal.com]

It's okay, I might have snapped and I apologize. The sixth paragraph of this http://noseriouslywhatabouttehmenz.wordpress.com/2012/02/18/human-rights-abuses-and-prison-rape/ just got in my mind today and freaked my wee brain out.

[achika-chan.livejournal.com]

D: That article is horrifying.

[aunt-zelda.livejournal.com]

That part REALLY bothered me. Yeah, a tumblr full of angry defensive anons is totally the right place to address internet stalking and I'd definately admit to being harassed in front of people who'd flat-out deny my "wild accusations" just because the person harassing me is mildly famous and comes across as so nice in videos ...

Actually, that makes me REALLY angry now, considering what one of my best friends has gone through in her life. There's no better way to get me angry than to start victim-blaming.

I think people say Rants is nice because for the most part he's in charge of this big opinionated mess, and he gets upset and anxious when people are upset because of the blog. It's a pity kind of thing, like, I feel bad that someone who's socially awkward is trying to deal with tricky situations. But at this point it's irresponsible at times, like with the JO thing or the "someone is stalking people" thing. He really shouldn't be in charge of the blog by himself, he takes things too personally and he hasn't learned from past situations.

Can we talk about how much the tgwtgrumors person rocks? 'Cause they make me happy.

[achika-chan.livejournal.com]

Oh yes, I love the Rumor Elf so far! I am in AWE of the research they put into this stuff.

[aunt-zelda.livejournal.com]

I want to give them cookies and hugs and a shiny hat. No really, I would totally do that. Especially the shiny hat.

[achika-chan.livejournal.com]

Well, they ARE an elf...A raptor elf, but still an elf...

[aunt-zelda.livejournal.com]

Wait, do you leave milk out for elves, or was that for brownies? *scratches head*

[achika-chan.livejournal.com]

I'm pretty sure that was Brownies. And you can't tell them 'Thank You'. But then you leave milk and cookies for Santa, and he's an elf, so...I'm just confused now.

[aunt-zelda.livejournal.com]

(I love how many twists and turns this conversation has taken.)

I'm confused too ... I guess I'll stick with cookies and hugs and a shiny hat. Seriously, maybe we should make them a card somehow ...

[achika-chan.livejournal.com]

(LOL me too)

Probably a good idea.

[aunt-zelda.livejournal.com]

(Seriously, putting an issue to rest, to victim-blaming, to being angry at a person for how they handled a situation, to gender issues, to folklore ... it's like the conversations I have a dinner at college all the time! ... speaking of that, I'm hungry ... and it's dinner time ...)

Probably a good idea.
No time now, but maybe someday ... or if someone else gets a card going I'd gladly "sign" ...

[aunt-zelda.livejournal.com]

Oh god, I'm sorry.

Yeah, that whole "one of the contributors is a stalker" situation bothered me a lot. I honestly don't think he's the best person to be running that blog. He takes things personally and freaks whenever one of the contributors mentions the blog on their twitter ... dude, it's not YOUR fault, they're just reacting to a secret some anonymous person made, it's not a reflection of you. And he doesn't really handle big crises well ... at all. In certain situations he should post the secret, post relevant information (like Holly's contact info) and then not post any of the ensuing messages about "so and so is a liar" or whatever. It just makes things worse.

Over in fanficrants, somebody midway through a rant about how authors kept dividing people up into 'straight' and 'gay' said 'bisexuals are not unicorns! They exist!' and someone decided to make 'Bisexuals/Pansexuals Are Not Unicorns' icons. I snatched up one while I could. :-D
So true ... I'm in college now and I feel uncomfortable at times because I'm worried people will assume I'm one of those girls who pretends to be bi to get attention at parties or whatever but is actually straight at heart.

[freya-sacksen.livejournal.com]

As I said on my lj, it's a good thing he wasn't involved in the early days of the fandom - he would have been eaten alive.

It makes me really, really fucking angry the way he treated the claim. The way he treated the whole situation was just fucking appalling and completely unacceptable. The fact that he called her a troll.

Fuck's sake.

[aunt-zelda.livejournal.com]

As I said on my lj, it's a good thing he wasn't involved in the early days of the fandom - he would have been eaten alive.
Eh, I think we would have sort of helped him along and taught him about how to deal with internet shitstorms and these situations wouldn't have gotten so far out of control. And if he'd said something potentially victim-blaming we'd have called him out on it, and that would have been that.
Plus, we were a really collaborative fandom in the early days by necessity because there were like six of us for the first couple months (and we still are pretty collaborative, what with all the AUs everyone's writing in and adding to) so the problem of one person tackling all that stuff by themselves wouldn't have been so much of a problem. Now there's a second admin, thank god, hope they even things out a little.

It makes me really, really fucking angry the way he treated the claim. The way he treated the whole situation was just fucking appalling and completely unacceptable. The fact that he called her a troll.
Fuck's sake.
Yeah that's never a good idea. Who knows, maybe she was, but there's a chance she wasn't and that makes it unacceptable to throw around names like that. Personal judgements have no place on a secrets blog.

Kinda reminds me of when I defended objectophiles in the comments of one of Nash's videos, and he called me a troll in a livestream later and he and Roses and J-Dub all laughed. That still hurts.
Nowhere near as bad as this situation, but still, people throw around the word "troll" to describe people who say things that make them uncomfortable a bit too much.

[luvjoi]

I'm sorry that happened *gives a cookie*

I remembered being called a noob years ago on a Pokem"on Glitch forum, doesnt hurt now and I don't really care anymore, but back then I kinda was hurt, like why the "hell would you call me a noob. I was just posting what I apparently thought wasn't found before in Pokemon Diamond/Pearl before."

Here's a unrelated story to cheer you up:

I rewatched The Great Game, well half of it really, but I noticed this time around the Sherlock was using IE on his laptop, my reaction was

"O_O....why are you using.....you should use any other browser really...how...for being such a genius..."