aunt_zelda (
aunt_zelda) wrote2011-02-02 07:37 pm
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Entry tags:
- help,
- personal,
- rant,
- ranty-rant,
- today
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF-
So, tvtropes, one of my favorite places on the internet, has been going through some befuddling and irksome changes over the past couple of months. As I've been busy and the changes haven't been too inconvenient (YMMV pages, separating tropes that YMMV on to a different page ... eh, annoying but whatever.)
But now they're talking about DELETING PAGES. (Go here and vote!) Namely THE FETISH FUEL PAGES!!!!!!
FUCK NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It upsets me greatly when ANYTHING online is deleted, especially whole pages, especially ones that bring me joy.
Moving the 'Troper Tales' stuff to another website sounds like a good idea to me. Outright deleting all that stuff seems ... kinda drastic. What's going on? If you're offended by something you read in a Troper Tales page ... don't read something labeled 'Fetish Fuel.'
Do you have any idea how many shows/movies I've watched simply because of something I read on a Fetish Fuel page? I don't even know, I've stopped keeping track. I personally like to know what, ahem, excites other people. It's interesting to me. If I'm squicked, I move on. I don't start crying for the whole thing to be taken down because someone's fetish is disturbing to me.
Does anyone know if saving a webpage means you really save it, so even if it's deleted it'll still be there on your desktop ... or does saving it as a 'Web Archive' mean you basically create a shortcut that will stop working once the original page is deleted? 'Cause if the Fetish Fuel pages are going, I'm SAVING as much as I possibly can in the limited free time I have. Actually, if saving something as a 'Web Archive' doesn't work, I would be willing to PAY PEOPLE MONEY to take screenshots or whatever to preserve the pages and e-mail those to me, if the Fetish Fuel pages are indeed going to be deleted, because I don't have a lot of free time right now.
Edit: saved all the pages that are relevant to my interests. Voted all I could. I'll try and do more tomorrow, right now I need to sleep.
So what if I'm a perv? At least I don't think I have the right to judge other people's fetishes.
But now they're talking about DELETING PAGES. (Go here and vote!) Namely THE FETISH FUEL PAGES!!!!!!
FUCK NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It upsets me greatly when ANYTHING online is deleted, especially whole pages, especially ones that bring me joy.
Moving the 'Troper Tales' stuff to another website sounds like a good idea to me. Outright deleting all that stuff seems ... kinda drastic. What's going on? If you're offended by something you read in a Troper Tales page ... don't read something labeled 'Fetish Fuel.'
Do you have any idea how many shows/movies I've watched simply because of something I read on a Fetish Fuel page? I don't even know, I've stopped keeping track. I personally like to know what, ahem, excites other people. It's interesting to me. If I'm squicked, I move on. I don't start crying for the whole thing to be taken down because someone's fetish is disturbing to me.
So what if I'm a perv? At least I don't think I have the right to judge other people's fetishes.
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ETA: Oh, right, forgot to mention that any images or other media that are hosted elsewhere and hotlinked (like if someone uploads a picture to tinypic and then posts it on their blog) won't be accessible if you're not connected to the internet and/or if the files are moved or deleted. Those files are separate from the webpage you've saved, though. So save images to your harddrive if you want to keep them, too.
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So, will the external links work even if the page is deleted, or will I have to copy the html codes for the links?
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You're welcome. =)
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Is it working now? (If not, it might be because it's the forums and you need a tvtropes handle to see those, I think.)
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Not a fan of axing the Fetish Fuel page though. It's HOT.
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Not a fan of axing the Fetish Fuel page though. It's HOT.
I know, right?! Since when is it ok to judge people for their kinks and/or fetishes?
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I like that the reason for axing it is that kids might see it. WHAT?! (By like I mean I think it's bullshit, obv.)
And Hilariously Abusive Childhood to be axed because child abuse is never funny. Of course it's not but one of the examples on there is a character quoted as saying neither of his parents showed up for his birth which doesn't happen in real life.
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*shrugs* Sorry, I don't know what's going on, then ...
I like that the reason for axing it is that kids might see it. WHAT?! (By like I mean I think it's bullshit, obv.)
Yeah, because the most disturbing thing a kid with internet access can come across is ... THE TVTROPES FETISH FUEL PAGE! *lightning crack*
... seriously, whaaaaaa? If they want porn, they'll find porn. If they don't want to find porn, they'll click the 'back' button and maybe have some embarrassing questions for mom and dad. It's not like there's graphic images or anything, just people talking honestly about things that get them excited.
In fact, this is starting to make me ANGRY, not scared (because now I've saved the webpages to my desktop), ANGRY. What gives them the right to say 'yeah, talk about shows and books all you want ... but don't talk about anything naughty! Heaven forbid you talk about naughty things!' It's a popular site, they can put up more adds or whatever and get more servers to accommodate for the Troper Tales stuff. It's not that difficult.
(I gotta ask .. .who's the beauty in your icon?)
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That would be Robert Sheehan. It's from one of the episodes in his show Misfits that I can't help but highly recommend if you haven't already seen it.
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Reading the comments, it seems to me that the mods are letting personal bias get in the way of things. It's not about kids or adds, it's about the squicks of the few outweighing the likes of the many. The mods have been wanting to ax highly popular pages for a while now? Really? Since when do half-assed complaints warrant deletion of whole pages? What kind of internet is this?!?!?!
That would be Robert Sheehan. It's from one of the episodes in his show Misfits that I can't help but highly recommend if you haven't already seen it.
He's adorable. (Oh, right, I saw the first couple episodes of Misfits ... kinda liked it, the general nastiness of the characters didn't appeal to me. Might check it out again later, it make me nostalgic for Heroes ... *wibbles*)
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Yeah, I guess you just get used it... Plus there's a lot of character development, especially in the second season. With the exception, actually, of Robert's character, Nathan. Who just gets more and more over the top because the writer of the show clearly wanks to him.
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Good luck!
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I just hope they realize they're being stupid. *Sighs* Let's cross our fingers...
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I mean, there aren't graphic images or links to porn sites, it's mostly just people saying 'so-and-so from such-and-such being tied up was HOT.' And on tvtropes, it's a little late to start 'thinking of the children' (which is an expression that means BULLCRAP on the internet. The kids are already here, they've already seen more naked people than a streakers convention, and they know more sexual terms than their parents because they went to urbandictionary to search words they didn't understand. Then they went tvtropes and read up on their favorite show. I understand keeping the pedophilia stuff off, that's just fine, but lumping ALL Fetish Fuel as 'wrong' and saying just because something squicks you means it should be DELETED!?!?!???!?! I'M GONNA SMASH SOMETHING!!!!!!!!!!!)
Apologies for MY incoherence, I'm up too late and need to get to sleep.
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Nash can suck my toes?no subject
Fuck that. I'll stir drama.
http://www.formspring.me/JesuOtaku/q/156938226634888105
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...
...
...
Excuse me, I have to go throw up.
Fuuuuuuuuuuuuck! Why is the internet falling apart this year? WHY?! I really don't need this, any of this DRAMA. I have too much work and my free time is limited and when things like the Kink Meme and tvtropes and stuff keep happening and I have to freak out and try to help and that takes me away from my schoolwork and if I fail I FAIL, big time and then I don't know what I'll do ... *calms down*
God, JO ... you're the kind of person I used to want to punch back in elementary school. I used to think you were a cool person. Funny. Nice. Sexy. Intelligent. I thought it might be fun to hang out with you someday, somehow.
How can someone so cool and smart be so awful and stupid inside?
... not gonna watch any more of HER reviews. No adds giving HER money from my clicking!
What a ... a ...
You know what, I'm gonna go to bed now, and I'll come back tomorrow with a proper insulting term for her, ok?
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*tries to stifle RAGE* I mean, I'm not gonna troll her or anything, even though she basically just trolled my life, my dad's life, and countless other peoples' lives. (We are courteous and respectful to our enemies, for it kills them slowly. *twitches*) But I am SO. VERY. ANGRY. at her right now. Plenty of STRAIGHT people are unhappy in life, does that make being straight a bad thing? JO: you fail logic, FOREVER!
I actually had a pretty good day. It was a snow day. I got some stuff done and mostly goofed off, in a fog because last night I stayed up until three in the morning, for no real discernable reason. I've been having a stressful year (since last spring, really) and grappling with that as best I can. Internet drama cropping up within weeks of each other ... not fun. I'm trying, really I am, but when my safe havens start having their own disasters it's kinda ... horrible.
I figure if nothing else, someone else who wasn't straight might appreciate it (unless I've read you wrong, at which point you can point at me and laugh).
Um, well I'm not straight (not since The Summer Girl ... *sighs* Helen, aptly named because her face COULD launch a thousand ships. After ten minutes in her proximity she launched me right into bisexual land. Unfortunately, she's actually a bitch and I've barely spoken to her ever, but OH MY GODS SHE IS SO GORGEOUS ... *swoons* I've since figured out that I'm in courtly love with her, like, I love the IDEA of her, her beauty and all, loving her from afar and writing truly embarrassing sonnets because she is My Muse.) and I do get REALLY ANGRY at homophobes, so yes, you have read me right.
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I've been queer since I was 12. Well, no, I was gay until I was fourteen, bi since I was 14, and pan since I was 16. I've identified as genderqueer for a little less than a year.
I'm used to this shit. I'm used to being told I don't exist. I'm used to being told I'm wrong and I'm bad. I was kicked out of Yeshiva, I was threatened, I was bullied.... -shrug- What can ya do?
It's the kind of bigotry that JO is exhibiting that I hate the most. The well meaning kind. The guy on the corner raving about god hating fags, I can cross the street and avoid. The nice girl who is the reason I've got a much more sizable anime collection? It's a punch in the stomach.
I'm so angry. So, so angry. I mean, I'm used to being angry, I'm used to being disappointed, but gods damn it all, I am so tired. I'm tired of swallowing shit to save the afternoon, tired of being nice, tired of all of this shit.
Because... y'know what? A big part of me wants to jump up and down and yell "Fuck you, straight people! Fuck you and your privilege, fuck you!". But I can't because I have to be good. Because no progress will be made if we all do that.
And were I a meaner person, a fuckton of JO femslash would be breeding. Good thing I'm such an angel, eh?
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I was wishing for girl-crushes ever since I found out what a lesbian was. (Growing up with a gay dad, my mom had boyfriends and my dad had boyfriends, so I just thought that everybody had boyfriends. So naturally it took me a little while to understand the concept of lesbians. No boyfriends? Huh ... *giggles* My childhood was strange ...) I'd just about given up on being attracted to girls ... and then SHE appeared. Now I'm happily bisexual. Hurray!
I'm used to this shit. I'm used to being told I don't exist. I'm used to being told I'm wrong and I'm bad. I was kicked out of Yeshiva, I was threatened, I was bullied.... -shrug- What can ya do?
Have I mentioned the constantly hugging you through the internet? Because that's what I'm doing. *glomps you some more*
It's the kind of bigotry that JO is exhibiting that I hate the most. The well meaning kind. The guy on the corner raving about god hating fags, I can cross the street and avoid. The nice girl who is the reason I've got a much more sizable anime collection? It's a punch in the stomach.
Yeah, that really is the worst. Everyone can agree that the crazy "GOD HATES FAGS!!1!!!111!!!!!" a-holes are awful, but it's the 'nice' people who are ok-people for the most part who upset me the most.
Because... y'know what? A big part of me wants to jump up and down and yell "Fuck you, straight people! Fuck you and your privilege, fuck you!". But I can't because I have to be good. Because no progress will be made if we all do that.
Well, not all straight people are evil. Tons of them are awesome. (Hey, I used to think I was straight.) And some homophobes ... sorry, "people who think homosexuality is unnatural but don't actually HATE gay people because that's not PC" turn out to be gay.
What's really getting me about this is that an adult intelligent woman with access to the internet thinks that homosexuality is "unnatural." I thought it was just right-wing religious idiots who thought that anymore. *headdesk*
And were I a meaner person, a fuckton of JO femslash would be breeding. Good thing I'm such an angel, eh?
I'm not gonna deny that when I read that I instantly thought (after the bile-rising, I'm-gonna-be-sick, moment, of course) to myself 'heh, you know what I want to do? Make a prompt to the kink meme about JO being a closeted lesbian and grappling with that and someone from the site helping her realize it's ok to be gay and helping her through the angst of hating herself and stuff ... no healing sex or random gayness, just realistic angst and closeted-ness and nicely handled outing and stuff ...'
Does that make me a horrible person? Maybe. I still want to ask for it, though. It's not like I'd use the fic to be mean to her, just to encompass the 'so many people who call it unnatural turn out to be gay themselves and that's actually really sad' line into story-form.
Or, you know, PWP of her and the Nostalgia Chick or something. But I like plot to channel my anger, just out-and-out porn wouldn't accomplish that.
Not that I'd object to that ... f-locked, of course, don't want anyone to get upset ...Wow, I'm a a real bitch when people upset me.
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I've got an essay breeding, weirdly enough. It's about never being in the majority.
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on your side, straight people can be just as unhappy as homosexuals, and both 'types' have their own sets of problems.
on her side, heterosexuality is more widely accepted, and most of the homophobia exhibited by the state still hasnt quite gone away (why else would prop 8 have gotten proposed initially?), so there is that deep-rooted stigma for them to deal with.
but back on your side again, what jesu has to remember is that if people in relationships are suffering, it might not necessarily be solely due to that stigma. all sexualities (hetero-, homo-, bi-, possibly a- as well) are equally prone to problems like domestic violence, cheating, lying and general lack of trust. their unhappiness might not evne be due to the relationship to begin with - it could be due to a serise of accumulating outside factors.
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**Delurks shyly**
deletetake care of the Fetish Fuel pages?http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=1296693474014840100&page=1
There's about four people right now suggesting a different site, but the rest want it all gone by yesterday. :(
Re: **Delurks shyly**
You shouldn't lurk, I love comments! *browses your journal* Similar interests! Doctor Who! Woot!
*reads more* "Wise and mighty" eh? *blushes*
You've got a "fangirl crush" on me? Really? Wow ... am I really that big already? This is doing nothing good for my ego, you know!
Re: **Delurks shyly**
Ahh, I'm just shy. I always feel like I'm intruding.... (o_o) Yay, Interests!
(o////o) That, and you're kinda awesome...
Re: **Delurks shyly**
Well ... don't! I relish discussions and enjoy comments.
Yay, Interests!
Indeed! Woot!
(o////o) That, and you're kinda awesome...
*blushes* I don't know why you think that but thank you!
Oh, this picked a baaaad time to get my attention....
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It looks like the decision has been made. It's a shame. I liked that page and not for the obvious reason. I genuinely got a lot of laughs out of it. As its fairly obvious what it contains, not linked to on the main wiki much, and easily avoided, what's the problem with it? Maybe I'm just unusual in that I was only occasionally weirded out by something there.
I loved Troper Tales too. Again, maybe its just me but I love hearing stories of other people's lives as I find them to me entertaining, humorous, and/or insightful. And reading applications of tropes to real life helps me to do the same and gives me a new way to view my past.
I would've expected a few people to want them deleted, but not this many! I fear that TVtropes is losing its personality and humor by gradually becoming more formal and less personal. I can understand the desire to become less "injoke"y, more accessible and more organized. And of course, removing troll/flame bait. But I also think that they're toeing the line of "too far" and risking the loss of the charm that made it so much better than the Other Wiki (to me at least).
[Hyperbole joke] At this rate we'll have to start adding "citation needed" to every page. [/hyperbole joke]
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As I read more and more comments, I realized that it wasn't about revenue, protecting children, or any of that. It's about personal bias of the mods and a couple squicked people. Which ... rubs me the wrong way entirely. Plenty of people WEREN'T squicked by those pages. Plenty of people LOVE those pages. Plenty of people can READ 'Fetish Fuel' and decide whether they want to run the risk of reading something naughty.
I loved Troper Tales too. Again, maybe its just me but I love hearing stories of other people's lives as I find them to me entertaining, humorous, and/or insightful. And reading applications of tropes to real life helps me to do the same and gives me a new way to view my past.
Me too! It's awesome!
I would've expected a few people to want them deleted, but not this many!
It's actually rather frightening to me. These are the people I've been sharing the site with? Wow ... what a bunch of jerks.
I fear that TVtropes is losing its personality and humor by gradually becoming more formal and less personal. I can understand the desire to become less "injoke"y, more accessible and more organized. And of course, removing troll/flame bait. But I also think that they're toeing the line of "too far" and risking the loss of the charm that made it so much better than the Other Wiki (to me at least).
I couldn't agree more. If people want hard facts, go to the Other Wiki. If people want jokes, fun, and information too, go to tvtropes.
What I don't get is why they can't just hire more mods or whatever to keep the trolling and flame bait down and come up with some parameters for the more controversial pages (like, no mention of child pornography, which seems to be the most common complaint?), instead of just deleting the whole thing because a few people whined loud enough. It's a popular site, surely there's people willing to be mods?
Also, is it just me, or does the google-searchbar thing SUCK? I miss the old one, it was much easier to read and it worked better!
[Hyperbole joke] At this rate we'll have to start adding "citation needed" to every page. [/hyperbole joke]
*snerk* ... oh god, that's not funny ...
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I noticed that too. I also noticed that a lot of them seem to be using "removing potential flame bait" as an excuse. Looking at both sides, I did notice more borderline flaming comments upon revisiting some of the pages. Which is, as you said, where the mods come in. Or maybe that community of editors who'd delete such comments if they gave a clear set of guidelines as to what should be deleted. Or just asked for the help.
Sorry. I tend to have terrible timing (hee! alliteration!) with attempted jokes. (Hence the joke label, this being the internet and all.)
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It seems like they're far too eager to just up and delete the stuff, instead of trying to make it work and get some gorram mods in there and put up some guidelines, they're all "... screw it, DELETE!" Methinks the vote was just a formality and for show.
Sorry. I tend to have terrible timing (hee! alliteration!) with attempted jokes. (Hence the joke label, this being the internet and all.)
It's ok, I'm not mad or anything, it was more of a 'hee! ... oh, wow, I shouldn't have laughed ...' moment. Dark Humor FTW, and all. (Alliteration is awesome!)
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That was the impression I got from the few pages I could stand to read. We could start some sort of protest. There's gotta be more people against this than just however-many-people in this one comment section.
Ok good. Just checking! Dark Humor is one of my specialties! (Well-timed dark humor? Not so much)
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What a really stupid thing for JO to put down
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What a STUPID thing to say, especially in the age of the internet. I'm still kinda shocked.
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Auuuuuw! That's awesome! You should post that to the thread! (Yeah, I mean, reading about other people being into Cal Lightman, gunporn, HoYay, Cal Lightman, my secret dark dark fetish, Cal Lightman, and such was really nice. It's fun to talk about that with a group of like-minded people. It's what the internet should be about.)
Fast Eddie calling all that "squicky" is worse than blasphemy.
Who is this Fast Eddie guy anyway? Who died and made him king?One person's personal squicks shouldn't decide the fate of a whole website. What gives him (and the other two mods in the conversation) the right to judge on the rest of us?no subject
I never watched her reviews anyways and i'm not gonna watch her stupid reviews.
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And STUPID.I just ... wow. I used to RESPECT her, and now I just feel sick and betrayed.It's like when I found out Linkara is a Republican ... but then I found out he's pro gay rights, more fiscally Republican than socially, so that's ok. JO ... is not ok.